Warning: This is a rush transcript generated automatically and may contain errors.
Asbed Bedrossian: Hello, everyone. This is the September 6th Armenian News Network Groong Week in Review. Thanks for joining us. Hi, Hovik.
What’s going on?
Hovik Manucharyan: Not much, Asbed, just another podcast. How are you doing?
Asbed Bedrossian: I’m doing fine. I’m glad that people are listening to us. And so let’s just hit our topics. Go ahead.
Hovik Manucharyan: Okay, so let’s cover the war in Ukraine a little bit. So on September 5th, yesterday, there was a meeting in Moscow between Steve Witkoff, Jared Kushner, and Vladimir Putin. Apparently it lasted over three hours, although they say it wasn’t continuous. and you know let’s talk a little bit about the key outcomes because we talked last week about the visit of the CIA chief to Moscow and all the apparent western shuttle diplomacy that’s going on and how you know I think we both see that Russia now has increased its leverage as it’s pummeling Ukrainian cities, including the Ukrainian capital.
What’s interesting is that this is the first Trump said that there was a concrete proposal from Russia on the table
Asbed Bedrossian: What’s that, for ending the war, basically?
Hovik Manucharyan: for ending the war. And Witkoff and Kushner essentially used this proposal and new ideas, quote-unquote, to discuss in Moscow. And now, I think today they are in Kiev to discuss the issue with Zelenskyy. think this is a very interesting approach by Putin who is leaving the door open to diplomacy between the United States and Russia with Witkoff and Kushner acting as intermediaries. have been revealed, but I mean, Russia’s position on the war has been clear, and they have been reiterating it most recently a few days ago when Russian officials said basically the only way this will be resolved is if the root causes of the conflict are addressed.
And the root causes, of course, are NATO encroachment in Ukraine.
Asbed Bedrossian: Hovik, I am not sure how much ground there is to come to a complete agreement
Hovik Manucharyan: Now there’s, yeah.
Asbed Bedrossian: at this point in time. I think the United States is a little too busy domestically to worry about this. I think Trump is limited in his activities because of the midterm elections. Europe needs America. think that one of the last things that I heard about this topic this past week is that they are not going to accelerate military aid to Ukraine.
So that’s just kind of remaining. And just like you said, I don’t believe that Russia is about to give up its fundamental root causes for the war all the way back to Minsk Agreements. So it’s going to continue. And just like I said, I just don’t see.
I’m just waiting until the war is over because what’s really important is for us to see Russia pay a little more attention to the South Caucasus .
Hovik Manucharyan: Yes, I think that the Russian position is undoubtedly getting stronger. If you look at the military map, slowly, but it is now going to the point where the Sloviansk-Kramatorsk line now is under threat, and every day there are new villages. It is slow, but like we discussed, I think that militarily Russia will not let down, especially after Ukraine has increased its attacks on civilian targets, apparently. Now, the biggest factor for me is that the EU will always, it appears, be a monkey wrench in all of these negotiations.
So the elephant in the room, I mean, it is an elephant because they are directly funding They are helping Ukraine in all manners. and the US is as well, but the EU is completely engaged and going towards a war footing with Russia, with Germany in the lead. So I think Russia also wants to fix the Germany problem, which is, you know, neuter it a little bit and the support of Trump in terms of this war, in terms of economic support will be a major factor in taming European ambitions. But we have to see movement on that front.
Asbed Bedrossian: Hovik, today is September 6th. We’re recording this on September 6th, 2026. Four days ago, September 2, was the 35th anniversary of September 2nd, 1991. Nagorno-Karabakh and Shahumyan declared independence as the Soviet Union collapsed.
And they exercised their UN-recognized right to self-determination. And may I add something that was completely compliant to then-existing Soviet constitution as well. And then they supported this decision by a December 1991 referendum where 99.9% voted for independence. Basically, they declared the establishment of the Republic of Artsakh, affirming the Armenian population’s legal right to self-governance.
Now, Pashinyan, this defeated charlatan in 2020, betrayed the cause of Artsakh, and he enabled and justified the defeat, blockade , starvation, and ultimate complete ethnic cleansing in 2023.
A multi-millennial homeland of Armenians is now empty of its indigenous people, just like historic Armenia was depopulated 111 years ago of us indigenous armenians during the armenian genocide now this is the reason why artsakh’s cause and their struggle for their rights and justice remains the cause of all of us armenians of our generation and future generations so i urge everyone every armenian don’t listen to anybody who wants to sell your history and your identity out, Hovik, any thoughts?
Hovik Manucharyan: Unless you’re ready to disown your own mother, your own children, your own family, then the identity of Artsakh is part of all of our identities. And what is happening right now is shameful.
That is, you know, the genocidal agenda is being carried out through the hands of Armenians. but you know I joined Asbed in urging everyone to not forget who they are and not fall for any lies or any gaslighting that there will be peace and for the sake of peace it’s okay to disown your mother it’s okay to sell off your family just for peace this is not a dignified peace and we are no way in support of it so that’s what I have to say of course september 2 it used to be a glorious day right we always celebrated it uh and um you know it has turned into a day of mourning almost but it’s important uh you know you know, when we watch the commemoration of the day a lot of people visited the Yerablur paid their respects to our fallen soldiers who gave their uh everything for their land made a call for dignified rights of Artsakh people, so that Antelias so that all the major organizations in the diaspora and politicians in Armenia as well, of course excluding the bunch of I don’t know what we have at the head of the government today.
Asbed Bedrossian: The velvet pussies?
Hovik Manucharyan: I don’t want to, you know, yeah, the velvet pussies. The velvet shitbags. How’s that? Well, let’s stick with the term shitbag for the rest of this show, Asbed.
I want to just read a quote from Bagrat Srbazan, Archbishop Bagrat Galstanyan, because I think it’s poignant. I will not stop living for a second with the vision your great return, he’s talking to Artsakh, because my dreams and desires are greater than my life of a few years of limited days.
And yes, since we have such a hope, we have great boldness in our conduct, because the Lord himself is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. 2 Corinthians, there is still a kernel of an immune system in our public consciousness and the only way that it can be erased is through complete totalitarianism which Armenia is going towards but I don’t think they’ll be successful I do want to mention one more thing
Hovik Manucharyan: the Artsakh National Assembly I mean there’s still body, I guess, but they haven’t had any elections. The Armenian government would ban and arrest anyone who attempted to do this.
Asbed Bedrossian: Mm-hmm.
Hovik Manucharyan: Pashinyan himself has threatened to do this many times. And for this reason, representatives of the Artsakh National Assembly have said that for now they’re essentially pausing on the idea of new elections. And it is unclear if they’re even functioning because Pashinyan has threatened, you know, there cannot be, you know, any organization in Armenia that represents another entity and so forth. But we’ll link in our show notes to all the quotes from different political actors. a very precarious situation because at any time, if they even make some statements that Pashinyan doesn’t like, they could be arrested
Asbed Bedrossian: Well, I think he said very clearly that if it was under pressure from the Armenian
Hovik Manucharyan: And Thank you.
Asbed Bedrossian: government that they have to freeze their activities for the time being,
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah.
Asbed Bedrossian: they cannot have elections, re-elections. So it is what it is right now.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah.
Asbed Bedrossian: But at least there is a body. There are representatives for 150,000 people. And there was a note saying that they regret to see their community being spread all over the world at this point.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah. Okay, so the major news from last week, of course,
Hovik Manucharyan: was the Shanghai Cooperation Organization Summit. We talked about it with Suren Sargsyan. I don’t think there’s anything major to rehash, but, you know, the biggest issue that I think is worth noting is that Armenia, basically, when in his speech, I think public speech, mentioned that, hey, you know, you should not be against Armenia exercising their quote-unquote, you know, sovereignty by diversifying its partners because diversification and multipolarity is in the spirit of the SCO. Armenia has been attending the SCO for two years.
If Armenia was even marginally serious joining this organization, participating in BRICS , you would expect to see something in terms of formal actions, formal records, right? But if you look at, if you look at Armenia’s five-year program, right? Let’s take that as an example. Nothing, nothing is mentioned about the SCO.
I think that is, you know, the evidence that we have to go with. This is all just lip service and Armenia trying to weasel from one corner to another like a mouse while not standing up for its own rights. And of course, when I say Armenia, I mean the Pashinyan regime, is an occupational regime controlled directly by Azerbaijan. That’s all I have to say. want to talk about the Putin-Pashinyan meeting?
Asbed Bedrossian: Very quickly, very quickly, because I do want to remind that the previous episode to That was a very interesting conversation that encompassed some of the events from That was a very interesting conversation that encompassed some of the events from the Shanghai Cooperation Organization meetings, including Aliyev and Pashinyan and then also Putin and Pashinyan. But I think, you know, it’s a few days later and we can simply say that Putin basically was very, very clear that there should be a referendum to give the Armenian people a voice in deciding EU or Eurasian Economic Union. He said it’s completely okay to choose the European Union.
But if that’s what the people want, and they should, of course, be told the truth that they can choose one or the other. And the Armenian people already know where their bread is buttered. Right. and we’re going to talk a little bit about that in a moment.
Hovik Manucharyan: I think, you know, I want to take a little contrarian position on that. I think that if a referendum in Armenia is held, there is a chance that many people will vote yes for joining the EU. But I think that the EU is not ready for that because it takes 25 years to join the the EU would be against any such referendum because then they would have to put up EU. And for it.
They would have to put up and help Armenia in terms of investments. But it’s clear that the EU’s agenda in Armenia is not actual membership. EU is just interested in Armenia antagonizing Russia. That’s all.
And, yeah.
Asbed Bedrossian: Hovik, it’s not a contrary view, but I think that we’re talking about spin. If you are just going to put a question saying, should Armenia join the European Union? Well, everybody’s going to vote for that.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah.
Asbed Bedrossian: I would vote for that. But will you be saying also, do you vote for leaving the Eurasian Economic Union? I think a lot of Armenians are going to look at their pocketbooks.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yes.
Asbed Bedrossian: They’re going to look at their exports, their products from their farms and everything. but that’s
Hovik Manucharyan: The
Asbed Bedrossian: the part of the spin, right?
Hovik Manucharyan: remittances
Asbed Bedrossian: They’re not going to be told that they’re going to be losing all of that.
Hovik Manucharyan: If tens of thousands of Armenians every summer go to Russia to get labor, temporary labor, all of that would be gone. I mean, there are entire towns that sustain themselves, unfortunately, based on this fact. So yes, it is a huge threat. And those are the cards that Putin has on the table.
But to be honest, I think that Putin is probably playing very high-stakes poker, you want, we’ll even take out the Russian base. But let there be a referendum. So if people were given a choice, you know, on a referendum, yeah, we want the Russian base out of Armenia. I think people wouldn’t
Asbed Bedrossian: Right.
Hovik Manucharyan: vote for that either. Yes.
Asbed Bedrossian: want to do a segment that we want to call How I Stopped Worrying About EU Import Duties and Learned to Love Cucumbers. How’s that for a topic for the segment?
Hovik Manucharyan: Very lovely.
Asbed Bedrossian: And this is because the EU has promised to so-called liberalize, and I think that our government is very happy to have this language, liberalize, 80% of Armenian exports, meaning that they will be exempt from EU import tariffs. This is great. The main issue with the EU’s headline figure, 80%, is the discrepancy between product range and actual capacity and quotas. What the government is not telling you is this, okay?
The percentage applies to the breadth of the product lines. So if you have 1,000 products, 800 of them are essentially tariff-free or reduced tariffs or something like that. So that looks really great, 800 products that you can. But the EU quotas, the actual trade volume is not specified in there. while the tariff waiver covers almost all of the fresh fruits, vegetables, beverages, the EU is going to apply strict tariff rate quotas on primary Armenian exports.
So for key products, for example, things that Armenia really produces, let’s say the apricots, they can only export 16% of what they produce, and that’s going to be tariff-free. And for other things like plums, 13%, and there’s a table for everything. So a small percentage of what we produce, what Armenia produces, can go to the EU tariff-free.
Hovik Manucharyan: This is like going to Best Buy, buying like one of each of the products at the store and saying, I bought all of Best Buy, you know, 100% of Best Buy is mine now. Yes, that’s exactly what’s happening. And it’s shameless, shameless PR. And if you read the EU announcement, this is only going to cost EU about 3 million euros. so you can estimate from that exactly how much they’re essentially subsidizing normally I believe I forget what the import duty is 10% right so but even if we say okay fine some products 16% of Armenian apricots will be able to be exported to Europe does can we declare victory
Asbed Bedrossian: No, no, we can’t declare victory.
Hovik Manucharyan: but, but, but, what about the amazing giant quota for cucumbers.
Asbed Bedrossian: Well, I’m glad you asked that, Hovik, because I love Armenian cucumbers. There’s nothing more refreshing than wiggly, squiggly, fuzzy Armenian cucumbers in the summer. But the problem is, my friend Pashinyan doesn’t really produce that many cucumbers.
Hovik Manucharyan: Ha ha
Asbed Bedrossian: So this is the problem. They have basically said Armenia can export 6,500 tons of cucumbers to Europe, but Armenia can only produce 1,100 tons of cucumbers.
Hovik Manucharyan: Thank you.
Asbed Bedrossian: So what good is that, giving these giant things, except for, basically, flesh?
Hovik Manucharyan: Tell us about the non-tariff barriers, Asbed, and also any additional other safeguard clauses that they have.
Asbed Bedrossian: Yeah. Yeah, the trade agreement includes standard EU safeguards and mechanisms. If Armenian imports actually start threatening to disrupt or undercut local European producers, Brussels is going to unilaterally be able to reimpose tariffs. You know, they can just basically say, oh, Spanish imports are going to suffer because of Armenian imports.
Well, then immediately Armenian imports are going to be tariffed. Dropping import tariffs does not instantly eliminate non-tariff barriers. There are things like certifications and standards. You know, Armenia is primarily built for the Eurasian Economic Union.
They’re not built for the European Union. They’re trying to go that way, but they’re not quite there yet. So if they’re going to start this kind of a problem, Europe basically reserves the right to say, oh, there are sanitary problems with these products and immediately stop it. And there are also logistical problems.
So, you and I have talked about this. Let’s take apricots, for example. Spanish apricots make their way to Germany, tariff-free, of course, in refrigerated trucks. Tell me, please, how Armenian apricots are going to get to Germany.
Hovik Manucharyan: You just close your eyes, cross your fingers, and you wish, and maybe it’ll happen.
Asbed Bedrossian: Yeah, there’s probably a fourth dimension or something like that.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yes. That’ll be like a little portal, like, you know.
Asbed Bedrossian: Let’s take refrigerated trucks. Let’s take refrigerated trucks. Are these trucks going to go through Turkey? No, the border is closed.
Are they going to go through Russia? Good luck. Are they going to go by boat?
Hovik Manucharyan: Well, they’re going to go through Georgia and the Black Sea.
Asbed Bedrossian: Well, if you want to eat 2026 apricots in 2027,
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah.
Asbed Bedrossian: it’s not really going to happen.
Hovik Manucharyan: I mean, economists…
Asbed Bedrossian: They’re going to go by airplane. They’re going to go by airplane. And I did a little bit of math, okay, in today’s market. Basically, Spanish apricots right now will cost approximately 3 euros per kilo, I think, in Germany.
Armenian air freighted apricots are going to cost 8 euros per kilo.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yep.
Asbed Bedrossian: It just doesn’t compete right now. Which one would you eat, Spanish or Armenian apricots?
Hovik Manucharyan: Hey, but I get, but I,
Asbed Bedrossian: It’s just your pocketbook, man.
Hovik Manucharyan: but I bet that Marta Kos will be able to make some nice pickles and sit on her desk
Asbed Bedrossian: I love to…
Hovik Manucharyan: and parade them in front of the cameras, but yes.
Asbed Bedrossian: So it’s a lot more PR right now than it’s real liberalization, let’s call it.
Hovik Manucharyan: Cucumber dysphoria, I would call it, you know.
Asbed Bedrossian: Hovik, do we have a cucumber paradox going on here?
Hovik Manucharyan: Yes, yes, cucumber paradox. And I don’t believe that there is a lab in Armenia, you can correct me on this if anyone knows, but I don’t believe there is a lab in Armenia today that certifies Armenian products for EU standards. And even if it did, I mean, you realize that this is stuff that people plant years in advance and plan for years in advance, including the fertilizer to use, including how they’re going to check the product. So none of the crop for this year will be certifiable, in my opinion, for EU standards, unless they waive those standards, too, which I don’t think EU countries will be able to do.
This is just a drop in the bucket. This is like also, you know, saying, Asbed, here’s a dollar. Oh, no, I need it back because it’s going to hurt my own people. You know, it’s so many like safeguards and circuit breakers.
And it’s just like very minor. But if you read Western-funded Armenian NGO press or any Western-funded press, you will only see that 80% of Armenian products have been liberalized. It’s just a sham.
Asbed Bedrossian: Yeah. Yeah, it’s really too bad. And the thing is that Armenia is so small compared to, let’s say, the EU or Russia, that right now the EU is plenty happy to pay the cost of the stuff just perishing if necessary and paying Armenian farmers 50 million euros every, I don’t know, six weeks or so, just as the cost of pissing off Russia.
Hovik Manucharyan: EU membership.
Asbed Bedrossian: It’s a geopolitical cost, right?
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah. Well, if they were serious, they would commit to say, okay,
Asbed Bedrossian: They can incur this.
Hovik Manucharyan: it’s going to take Armenia 20 years to join the EU. Okay, for 20 years, we commit to paying Armenia, right? It’s bullshit, I would not want it, but that would be the prize for…
Asbed Bedrossian: It would be, that would turn Armenia into a welfare state. It’s like international beggars, basically.
Hovik Manucharyan: Exactly. And we’re not even doing that, we’re just…
Asbed Bedrossian: No Armenian farmer would accept that.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah. and if there are tons of uh tv programs about how farmers are basically just getting rid of their products because they’ve perished and they can’t sell it anywhere so this isn’t a real issue and they’re trying to uh what i say they’re trying to gaslight people into believing hey now everything is fine you know putin is okay
Asbed Bedrossian: Yeah.
Hovik Manucharyan: with us the eu is funding 100 of our products you know one of each of the list of our products is just bullshit.
Asbed Bedrossian: Thank God there was a picture from the SCO with Putin and Pashinyan shaking hands smiling. Everything is great.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah. Yeah.
Asbed Bedrossian: Let’s go on.
Hovik Manucharyan: In fact, in the SCO, what’s funny is that right after Putin’s meeting, Pashinyan got on a Facebook Live from his motorcade and said, you can’t believe how great a meeting I had with Putin.
Asbed Bedrossian: Gagik Khachatryan.
Hovik Manucharyan: And then Putin had a press conference and says, well, if you guys want the Russian base out, we’ll do it. Just make a decision. And Pashinyan is like, well, you decide for me. How’s that?
He doesn’t like hard decisions.
Hovik Manucharyan: Anyway, so let’s talk about another serious statistic. So ever since Pashinyan and Aliyev have declared “lasting peace” at the White House in August last year, there is a bewildering statistic that is growing. And unfortunately, it’s not the good kind. We’re talking about deaths in the Armenian Armed Forces.
Just this year alone, there is a significant increase. I believe around 30, we have had 30 deaths this year compared to 11 last year, as of July. Some of the more recent incidents in August were most severe. There was a contract soldier, I believe, Grigor Zakaryan,
Asbed Bedrossian: Mm-hmm.
Hovik Manucharyan: who was found dead with a fatal gunshot wound. Suren Vardanyan was a conscript, and he was killed, and six others were injured because their commanding officers had taken them out of their base in Chambarak as punishment for whatever. They had a fight in the cabin here or whatever. So this genius decides to take them out of the base and make them jog on the highway at night.
And apparently, he also made them wear gas masks. And I think that would further impede their visibility. And unfortunately, they were run over by a vehicle on that highway. Now, after all this, they were denying everything about this.
They were denying the gas masks. they were denying that they were taken out of the base. But like everything with this government, we learn about it through the community, through people who saw and eyewitnessed it.
Asbed Bedrossian: Yeah. Hovik, that’s what galls me the most, that we do not read these things from government newspapers or press releases or anything. We have to learn it from other people and then investigative journalists have to go in and find these things out.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah. And then they try to spin it, right? They try to spin it. Now they’re like, okay, now once it’s made the news, now their heads are rolling at the Chambarak base.
But it’s not just a single base. This is a chronic problem. And I want to remind everyone that for each death like this, that would happen before 2018, the entire western funded NGO community would go to the point of parading the dead corpse in front of the Armenian government building just to raise pressure political pressure just for political points he absolved himself of criticism and responsibility,
Asbed Bedrossian: Ha ha
Hovik Manucharyan: forget but he absolved himself of criticism and responsibility, saying it’s a surprise to him that now the Minister of Defense should be responsible for deaths in the army? How odd. But of course we also remember that before 2018 everyone from president on down was blamed and pressure was put in international organizations, millions of dollars invested in NGOs that highlighted these issues, which is good. But now, I think these NGOs are severely underfunded now because it’s no longer necessary to put pressure on the Arman regime.
Asbed Bedrossian: Yeah, there’s a complete lack of accountability, I’m sorry to say. I mean, let’s go back two or three years, and there were the 15 soldiers who got burned in their barracks outside of Azat village. Whose head rolled for that? They just found some very low-level schmuck who, I don’t know exactly what happened.
He was tried and then put in jail for a while.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah.
Asbed Bedrossian: I have no idea. But it never rolled up. And then these horrible things that keep happening to the soldiers, you know, you never see a general or a colonel committing suicide.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah.
Asbed Bedrossian: There’s complete lack of accountability here. And, you know, I, for one, as an Armenian, demand more from this department. I want these
Hovik Manucharyan: So why do you think this is happening?
Asbed Bedrossian: well because there’s no accountability just like I said there’s no there’s there’s there’s no price that these people these Papikyans and these high level people they’re not paying any of the cost
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah.
Asbed Bedrossian: of all these soldiers dying
Hovik Manucharyan: And of course, when you look at someone like Papikyan, who stabbed his commanding officer and served time for it in prison, I mean, you exemplify that example. And there’s lack of discipline, there’s lack of morale. What could you expect from these incompetents in charge? Now, let’s remember in 2019, there was also like a spate of incidents in January of 2019, in the Artsakh Defense Army, which is a branch of the Armenian Armed Forces, or was a branch of the Armenian forces at the time.
And Pashinyan made loud noises about that. He replaced a competent commander of the Artsakh Defense Forces, Karen Abrahamyan. so the commander of the defense forces was replaced because of this and he replaced him with Jalal Harutyunyan and we know how that guy fared and how he performed in the
Asbed Bedrossian: Hmm.
Hovik Manucharyan: fighting anyway but what’s most appalling what’s most disgusting about all this is that pashinyan says that some of these deaths are actually because of his peace i mean can you think of
Asbed Bedrossian: Thank you.
Hovik Manucharyan: anything more Orwellian than that statement. He says, do you know what the excuse is?
Asbed Bedrossian: It just, yeah, it makes no sense to me.
Hovik Manucharyan: He says, well, right now, because there is no more enemy shooting at you, people are more lax and they can decide to sleep at their posts. And now there’s some kind of a fight over who gets to sleep during their watch on the posts. And because this a privileged right, or this is a privilege, people fight over it. And that’s why the deaths happened.
Can you imagine
Asbed Bedrossian: I don’t get it.
Hovik Manucharyan: what a scum you have to be to use that as an excuse and try to sort of, you know, blame it on its peace? What else can we say about this? I mean, there’s also dark stories about dark clouds hanging over Suren Papikyan’s own own
Asbed Bedrossian: Only five years too late, if you ask me.
Hovik Manucharyan: we, yeah, it’s rumored, and it’s not confirmed, but Armen Grigoryan, you know, the guy who was offended and wouldn’t, you know, take another position when he was relieved from the National Security Council?
Asbed Bedrossian: He was dumped.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah, he wasn’t dumped. This is a revolving door. And that’s why I was, like, hesitant to even talk about that in that light. a revolving door and they have no one to replace even Suren Papikyan with even the incompetent uh you know Suren Papikyan so what they probably might do is appoint Armen Grigoryan as defense minister and
Asbed Bedrossian: Okay, well, Hovik, let’s just talk about Armen Grigoryan right now. Why don’t you go ahead? What’s going on? I know he just released a book.
Hovik Manucharyan: of all, if anyone is on Instagram, there is a very popular and very smart creator there, Nune Melkumyan. We’ll link to her profile. Please follow her. She makes very interesting videos and is the kind of videos that I think people should get credit for on Instagram. educational and also very entertaining.
Asbed Bedrossian: We should get Nune on our show, Hovik.
Hovik Manucharyan: So we’d love to. Nune, we’ve had a discussion, so I hope you decide to come on our podcast soon. So Armen Grigoryan. Before 2018, he was the head of some NGO, not even, he was a local representative of an international NGO, handing out funds basically.
So all the local traders were looking to him for handouts. And I think it was called Democracy for Development. then just one week after Pashinyan’s regime change operation, I think May 17, 2018, he was appointed National Security Council. And he has served that position for eight years. through the 2020 war, sending 5,000 of our next generation to their graves, so our youngest, our most promising sons and daughters. Armenia’s own internationally recognized territory was occupied by Azerbaijan in 2022.
And of course, in 2023, Artsakh was ethnically cleansed. 150,000 people now have no home. And this government calls anyone who talks about the rights of Artsakh people as, what is he called, fascists or extremists or whatever. So much for national security under Armen Grigoryan. Now his book, he has a new book, it’s called Take a Step and Reject Serzh.
Asbed Bedrossian: What is it in Armenian? I think it’s Kayl ara, merzhir Serzhin.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yes.
Asbed Bedrossian: Something like that.
Hovik Manucharyan: A story of how their coup in 2018 happened. It’s like, you know, they flaunted their treason like it’s an accomplishment. And that’s, I think, the most defining characteristic of any one of these members is that they have no shame, no sense of dignity, because if someone, if Armen Grigoryan had any sense of dignity and any sense of shame, he would look at his previous position before 2018 on the issue of Artsakh and he would, I don’t know, he would at least lock himself in a cave somewhere for the rest of his life. Let me just read to you what he wrote 2012.
This is an article in MediaMax. title is The Relevance of Not an Inch. term for anyone who was against ceding any territory to Azerbaijan. So in his article he talks about how soft Armenia was in response to Aliyev when Aliyev called Armenians fascists at a Euronest session. What does Aliyev call to us every day today and what is Armenia’s response? Want to hear a few choice quotes from this article, Asbed?
Asbed Bedrossian: Yeah, yeah, please.
Hovik Manucharyan: Okay.
Hovik Manucharyan: These are the words of Armen Grigoryan, council who was previously the head of a western funded ngo negotiating with an enemy who wants to destroy us and promising them concessions a betrayal of the armenian people
Asbed Bedrossian: No.
Hovik Manucharyan: another quote one thing is clear concession that creates a threat to our lives is betrayal okay another one since the of the 20th century azerbaijan has repeatedly reminded us that in any situation. And after all, negotiating concessions with them is at least a crime against its own people.
Asbed Bedrossian: It’s unbelievable. people are such turncoats. I mean, if anyone said anything like this today, Hovik, Pashinyan would be throwing them in jail.
Hovik Manucharyan: Write to the, write immediately to the NSS Padval. But I think the only
Asbed Bedrossian: I mean, what are your conclusions from this kind of stuff?
Hovik Manucharyan: ban all the fucking foreign-funded NGOs in Armenia, period, no exception.
Asbed Bedrossian: I mean, Georgia essentially put accountability on all of them.
Hovik Manucharyan: And I won’t
Asbed Bedrossian: They wanted to know publicly their funding.
Hovik Manucharyan: It’s too little. Ban every single fucking one of them because all these people are traitors. And it’s clear, if you look at this rhetoric, he was just doing what he was paid to do. Because I don’t believe any sane person would say something like this in 2012.
And then today, you know what the punchline of this entire story is, Asbed?
Asbed Bedrossian: Say it.
Hovik Manucharyan: Armen Grigoryan was born in Martuni, Artsakh.
Asbed Bedrossian: Yeah, yeah, of course I knew that.
Hovik Manucharyan: and that is what really hurts that is what really hurts inside
Asbed Bedrossian: It’s just, and how many pictures are there of this guy sitting across the table from Hikmet Hajiyev?
Asbed Bedrossian: Okay, Hovik, for the sake of time, let’s move on.
Hovik Manucharyan: Okay.
Asbed Bedrossian: Let’s talk a little bit, just a little bit, about municipal elections, because over the coming months, we’re going to have a few of them. These are not major national elections, but they are municipal elections in various towns, and generally what’s going on is that the Pashinyan government is trying to make sure that, you know, they’re going to win. The next immediate local election is going to be in Lermontovo, in Lori, Arzni in Kotayk, and then Ferik in Armavir. The pre-election campaigns are starting tomorrow, September 7.
There will be more elections announced, of course, and we’ll keep you up to date on those things. So like I said, these are relatively small communities. Normally, they would not be major news, but after the disaster performance in the June parliamentary elections , and his cronies are basically out prove a point, that they can get high results in municipal elections. Their eye is on the big prize, Gyumri, which absolutely trashed them about a year ago, and which they hope to trigger elections sometime in the near future.
Every single municipal election is important for Pashinyan at this point in time. And of course, when the Civil Contract manages elections, what can we expect?
Hovik Manucharyan: you said that we can expect more government oppression against the opposition, then you win the prize. So amidst all this news about municipal elections, now we see that the Armenian government is cracking down against opposition heads in some of these municipal communities. The latest was in Noyemberyan, where Arsen Aghababyan was summoned. Initially, they reported that he was arrested, but he was summoned to the National Security Service.
Asbed Bedrossian: The Anti-Corruption Committee, they said.
Hovik Manucharyan: And they have some… Yeah. Essentially, my read is it’s a warning.
Asbed Bedrossian: Yeah.
Hovik Manucharyan: Either you can sort of collaborate with us, let us do what we want in Noyemberyan, or we’re going to take you…
Asbed Bedrossian: Or you’re going to be in pre-trial detention indefinitely.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yes. So we will report on this more, but this is roaring news. Of course, no fucking Western observer will talk about this, and we’re sick and tired of talking about it. But yeah, I think the focus will be on municipal elections.
Asbed Bedrossian: Yeah.
Hovik Manucharyan: The one in Noyemberyan is coming on November 27 this year, so it’s not in September. But yeah, I think that will be the next major battle before Gyumri and maybe a few more. But yeah, that’s the one where they really want to take power in Noyemberyan.
Asbed Bedrossian: Yeah, we’ll tally on all these things and we’ll keep people up to date because, like I said, it’s happening over the months. They’re kind of staggered. It’s not like one watershed event. But the season opens tomorrow, I guess, in America on Labor Day.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yep.
Hovik Manucharyan: I briefly want to talk about four different case studies of oligarchs in Armenia. So we all witnessed the manner in which Gagik Khachatryan was dragged out of his sickbed from his home, screaming in pain. dragged to court. I don’t know if you saw any of the pictures, but he was basically put out on a stretcher in front of the court, and you can see that he was wriggling in pain, and I don’t know, is that even legal to do that in any democratic society? I don’t want to talk about my personal thoughts about Gagik Khachatryan.
He was definitely not the light of my eye, as they say. Normally, I would reserve much stronger words for him, His punishment is being done for political reasons. I consider him a political prisoner still. And even the worst murderers, worst criminals deserve just treatment by the law.
That’s a normal thing that happens in democratic societies. The paradox is that criminals, murderers in Armenia walk free. they get bailed out but political prisoners get sent to the NSS jail Pashinyan of course gloated about this, he thanked all the NSS employees who participated in this and I think he’s basically using, I mean Gagik Khachatryan is a very toxic in my opinion figure using the aura from the past of his just for public opinion because the criminal cases, the criminal charges against him have been filed ever since 2018 or 19, I forget. So from the first days, he has been under criminal investigation.
The FBI in the United States has helped him uncover some, Pashinyan, uncover some assets of his in the US. Still, I mean, dragging someone in pain on a stretcher to court when previously several different judges for medical reasons have allowed him to stay at his home. I believe he’s in some kind of a home detention. So it’s just ridiculous.
And should make a stand. You know, it’s not about an individual. It’s about how the state and society and the relationship between the state and society
Asbed Bedrossian: I have not much to add to those stories, but there was a fake outburst on the part of Pashinyan about another guy recently, Narek Nalbandyan. What was that all about?
Hovik Manucharyan: So, so, so, Narek Nalbandyan, the media have written that he is very close to the Pashinyan family, at least I don’t know what kind of a relationship they have, I don’t ask, And Pashinyan said, I’m just seriously pissed off that Narek Nalbandyan won’t renounce his connections with my family, and our family is pissed off. And I’m ordering the NSS to, you know, investigate. Investigate what? Like, I don’t get that.
Asbed Bedrossian: Ha ha ha.
Hovik Manucharyan: Investigate what? He’s basically, like, acting as the sole judge, jury, and executioner. And then, of course, immediately…
Asbed Bedrossian: Well, he pretends like the NSS is basically his private military.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah, yeah. And a poor Narek Nalbandyan, he’s not poor, he’s a a big beneficiary of the Civil Contract regime. but his policy on any like publication about him and his closeness to the Pashinyans was silence but after Pashinyan’s threats every single company and every single social media site that he had he put a video of him saying you know I don’t know the Pashinyans I don’t know how I got this rich I don’t know how I’m a billionaire but yeah no connection to
Asbed Bedrossian: Hmph. Hahaha.
Hovik Manucharyan: let’s chart this guy’s trajectory before 2018 no one knew who he was and then in 2019 he acquires the Golden Palace Hotel in Tsakhkadzor this was taken from another oligarch someone that Pashinyan didn’t like and the government agreed to him to pay in tranches, essentially giving him a loan, so he was able take loans from the bank, and pay the government piecemeal, I think in very long repayment terms. Then we heard about him when he acquired Hovik Abrahamyan’s home. Now, Hovik Abrahamyan is another, I guess shady figure from the previous regime, and he had a home at the monument in Yerevan.
It was worth millions of dollars, and there was a freeze on his home. or a lien, a freeze by the government because it was part of a criminal proceeding. In one day, that freeze was removed, and there was a real estate transaction where Nalbandyan is now the owner of that property. And then, just like that.
Asbed Bedrossian: Just like that.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah, very market-oriented, very free, immediate, you know.
Asbed Bedrossian: Heh heh.
Hovik Manucharyan: He’s also now acquired Hayrapet Hotel in Sevan, He’s also now acquired Hayrapet Hotel in Sevan, It’s quite convenient that Hrazdan Cement Factory, belonging to Gagik Khachatryan, has been closed now. has been closed now. But if you listen to Narek Nalbandyan, who has many more businesses in Armenia, and all of a sudden has flowered into a billionaire in eight years, there is no relation between the government and Narek Nalbandyan.
Asbed Bedrossian: Okay, Hovik, let’s leave the next couple of oligarchs for next week. What do you think?
Hovik Manucharyan: Khachatryan, you’re going to be the topic for next week.
Asbed Bedrossian: Okay, well, we all look forward to that.
Asbed Bedrossian: Okay, let’s close with our corruptions and persecutions segment, Hovik. I know you have one thing that you want to talk about real fast, and then I’ll take something.
Hovik Manucharyan: So, I want to talk about a story that was not publicized very much.
Hovik Manucharyan: Remember when one of the traitorous priests who Pashinyan had recruited to go against the Armenian Church ? Of course, they caused a lot of problems for the church, but one of them is a criminal case where they are accusing the Catholicos and the church of withholding their salary. for that accusation, the accountant of the Aragatsotn Diocese was arrested this is a lady named Naira Alaverdyan and they gave her two months pretrial detention just like that just based on I think testimony from one person what
Asbed Bedrossian: Wait, is it? In any case, isn’t this like a civil matter? Somebody’s saying that paycheck wasn’t honored.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah, I mean, are a lot of with how this is done. But Naira Alaverdyan was sent to prison. Imagine an accountant doing her job. Her mom passed away while she was in prison.
And it just recently caught my eye, but this apparently happened earlier last month. the judge essentially found her after investigation found her not guilty and not guilty of the charges she was being accused of
Asbed Bedrossian: Why?
Hovik Manucharyan: because all of a sudden the people accusing her said oh my memory must be faulty and when they reviewed the electronic transactions because all these salaries are being paid through banks so the church was able to show that all these priests were paid so to me it sounds like a false accusation uh i guess
Asbed Bedrossian: How long was she in jail?
Hovik Manucharyan: i don’t know she was initially uh sentenced for two months but i don’t know maybe she was released mid-sentence
Asbed Bedrossian: But that’s horrible. I mean, her mom passed away in the middle, and chances are that the poor woman passed away because her daughter was being persecuted like that. From chagrin, from stress, from anxiety, or whatever.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah.
Asbed Bedrossian: I personally think that, what was her name? Naira Alaverdyan has a case against the government.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah. Yeah, it’s shameful. I mean, they’re playing with people’s lives, like many of the other cases we talk about. You won’t hear about any of this on Western media, of course.
Asbed Bedrossian: Hovik, I’m going to take it to the Catholicos case, because
Hovik Manucharyan: Okay.
Asbed Bedrossian: the third judge now has dropped out. You remember there were two judges initially, there was Hakob Manukyan who recused himself, then there was another judge who decided that he couldn’t do it, and then they threw this case over to Yerevan, I think, right?
Hovik Manucharyan: Vahagn Mikaelian? Yeah.
Asbed Bedrossian: And now the judge in Yerevan has decided this is not my deal. He dropped out. And then the prosecutor in the case, the prosecutor for the government, his name is Khachatur Galstyan. He’s also resigned and decided he’s not going to take it.
So we are in complete limbo in the case against His Holiness, Garegin II. And we’re just stuck. the one good thing that I’m hoping will happen is that these resignations will continue all the way up to the Prime Minister
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah, don’t hold your breath for it.
Asbed Bedrossian: Hmm.
Hovik Manucharyan: But, okay, coming to Aregnaz Manukyan.
Hovik Manucharyan: We’ve talked about her. She is being tried with Andranik Tevanyan.
Asbed Bedrossian: Hmm.
Hovik Manucharyan: If you remember, Pashinyan likes to announce his targets to the public ahead of time. So during, I believe, the campaign, he said, you are treasonous, you have committed treason, and you will go to jail for this. Next day, the NSS morning raid, they get dragged in. Actually, it wasn’t a morning raid, was an afternoon arrest.
But the clear charge by Pashinyan that every single media printed, even we said that the accusation was treason, right? Now the case gets sent to court, and the charge of treason is missing from the court. a lesser charge or some other charge, but for months
Asbed Bedrossian: What was she jaywalking?
Hovik Manucharyan: we were hearing also missing
Asbed Bedrossian: Unbelievable, Hovik.
Hovik Manucharyan: from the accusation that was sent to court was the fact that Andranik Tevanyan received $600,000 in exchange being recruited by foreign intelligence. All of these are completely missing. But if you look at Armenpress, if you look at government media, if you look at pro-Pashinyan media, that we were flooded with was that Andranik Tevanyan treasonous, he got 600,000 and was recruited by Russian intelligence, foreign intelligence, of course. And now none of that has made it to the case in court,
Asbed Bedrossian: Right.
Hovik Manucharyan: which just underlines that this is all… for PR. And they’re playing with people’s lives in the end. And let me remind again, Aregnaz Manukyan was deprived of even visitation rights for her. Her daughter was deprived of visitation rights with her mother, and her mother was deprived of visitation rights with her daughter.
Asbed Bedrossian: Mm-hmm.
Hovik Manucharyan: 14-year-old daughter couldn’t see her mother until the media raised the ruckus.
Asbed Bedrossian: Hovik, earlier you talked about one of the rogue priests. Well, there was another one, Stepan Asatryan. He had accused Archbishop Ajapahyan of having a wife and a child. And the court found that the priest had libeled Archbishop Ajapahyan,
Hovik Manucharyan: Former Priest.
Asbed Bedrossian: the former priest.
Hovik Manucharyan: Defrocked, rightfully.
Asbed Bedrossian: That’s right. He’s been, what is it, defrocked, excommunicated. And so the court actually ordered an apology and financial restitution for
Hovik Manucharyan: One million dram. So that’s like $3,000.
Asbed Bedrossian: One million dram.
Hovik Manucharyan: Still definitely not in line with, yeah, if it was an opposition member being penalized by the court, the fine would be much higher. But still, you know, it is what it is. Stepan Asatryan lied, and now it’s been proven in court. and that just proves that all these clowns that are now dancing to Pashinyan’s tune and have betrayed their own religion have betrayed their own church and have betrayed their own nation as a result I think they deserve to be mentioned in infamy. All the school books, all the history books should record their names Stepan Asatryan, traitor to Armenia and Armenian Church
Asbed Bedrossian: Hovik, earlier when we were talking about all the treasons and everything you said, but there’s still a glimmer of hope in the people. You know what? I actually think that there’s a lot of hope in the Armenian people. I think that the people who are doing the wrong things are a small group of powerful people.
But the people themselves, the Armenian people, they’re in the right place. Their heart is in the right place. They want the right thing. And so I’ve been initially surprised that some of these judges have recused themselves, and now the prosecutors recuse themselves.
But this tells me that the people know what’s right and what’s wrong. So it fills me with some hope, even though the story is not over.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah, of course, no one wants to go down in history, but I’m sorry, I’m not going to be so soft with these judges, because they could have said, you know, I’m a loyal member of the Armenian Apostolic Church, this is the leader of my church, and they could have recused themselves on that matter. I know it’s maybe a minor issue, nuance, but, you know, hey, I had a headache, or hey, you know, this is not my jurisdiction, things like that. It’s all BS, and have also, through their actions, I mean, many of those judges have tried other opposition members.
Asbed Bedrossian: Mm-hmm.
Hovik Manucharyan: so I think collectively 90% of their judges have been appointed by
Asbed Bedrossian: That’s right, they’re hand-picked cronies, basically.
Hovik Manucharyan: Pashinyan in one way or another and yeah maybe the buck stops at the church but did the buck stop at Artsakh? It didn’t stop at Artsakh? We lost our own homeland and if any of these judges had any hand in supporting Pashinyan all this time, I think when Pashinyan is gone from the activity of these judges needs to be carefully reviewed anyway.
Asbed Bedrossian: Okay. That’s all we have. Thank you for listening.
Asbed Bedrossian: Today is September 6, 2026. We hope, of course, as always, that you will like, you will share, and you will comment on our shows, you will hype our shows, and of course, we also hope that you will support us by going to podcasts.groong.org/donate and become sustaining members. We can really use your help. Thank you.
I’m Asbed Bedrossian.
Hovik Manucharyan: Yeah. And I’m Hovik Manucharyan, and I also want to mention, please don’t betray your values. Artsakh was a real cause that we fought for. and next year in Shushi.